Thanks for the support.  I think that if it wants to be a serious program they need a way to do those things, edit a file as root, run a browser in root, etc. I played around with commands with little success.  There are a lot of nice features here but it does seem to need some work.  I downloaded the code and will have a look, need to brush up my python anyway. 

Let's start with my first issue with sunflower. 

have an issue or perhaps a misunderstanding.  I use a fair amount of internal and external drives on my system.  This means that I am often swapping out thumbs, disks, etc as I work through the day.  With sunflower there are two things that I have noticed.  Sunflower sees all the external drives in my drive bay when the app is started.  Using mount manager to access them is not needed, I can go right in with the browser.  But there seems to be no response using mount manager to unmount, the checkmark disappears but the drives are still mounted and running mount in the terminal confirms this.  So drives have to be unmounted by hand in terminal (this is a deal breaker for me).  I am guessing he is using GIO or something similar to what Nautylust uses.  The good news is this might be overcome outside with a script by command.

Inversely I have 3 drives (besides my boot drive) that are internal.  In mount manager the drives show in the Volumes area (along with the external drives) but have empty boxes showing them as unmounted.  Attempting to mount them has no effect and there is nothing in my mounts folder.  Curiously this is the opposite issue I have had recently with SpaceFM (it won't mount the external drives but has no problem with the internal drives).  Besides wondering if there is something I am missing with the mount manager I also would like to know what is being called when you go to mount something?  Working on finding that out by looking at the code.  This is starting to get a little hairy.

Finally if I plug a thumb drive in to a usb there seems to be no reaction from sunflower.  It does not seem to see it nor does it offer me anything to do with it.  Again, is there something I need to do configure to make this come alive?  This is about where I am with SpaceFM right now, but with less features.  Also, this might be something that could be resolved.  I at least have some things to check on.

Not so serious Jedi.  I think it is good to keep up on it and am interested in hearing what is going on.  I just don't want to debate it anymore.  The personalities involved here are not really the point, it's what works, moving forward and really knowing what we have.  It is still possible that something else will rise above the rest, I just doubt we will see much from the people who keep spouting off.  I don't think they will come up with anything because they keep spending all their time spouting off, instead of ... you know.... working on a solution.  What's PackRat's quote "I'm am tired of talk that comes to nothing." very apropos to this topic.

For those who are interested this thread for posting customizations, issues, etc. for Sunflower file manager.

[added] quick link to Wiki https://code.google.com/p/sunflower-fm/wiki/WelcomePage

Thank you PackRat, that is a really nice find.  I really do think that SpaceFM is going to require a pretty major overhaul soon because of the udevil issues and changes in policies under the hood in Debian.  The disk stuff is really going to be changing and I wonder if they can keep up.  I have just started playing with sunflower but like what I have seen.  I need to monkey around with the customizations but like the simplicity and it looks clean.  installing it was a no-brainer with dependencies all already met.  This might be a nice little app to have around in the arsenal.  I just did a completely fresh install to JEDI and spacefm immediately died unless I was root.  No messages, no notifications, nothing logged.  It took me far too long (my issue) to realize that it was hating on my external quad drive bay and no amount of tinkering with udevil would seem to make them get along.  FWIW sunflower seems to be perfectly fine with it right out of the box. 

Rather than quote @PackRat and @VastOne I'll save space and say I agree with both their posts and add the following.

Beware of Bold Font like comic sans I wonder what all the shouting is about on that site. The fact remains that those who do, shut up and just do it.  There is choice now and if someone builds a better init or even distro or forks Debian and it is well done the people will come and will use it.  Until/if that happens systemd is here, it works and the choice has been made.  Personally, I may not like it but I have other things to worry about (I'll post about that later).  I will admit that I think udev, udisks, polkit, pam is all one big cluster at the moment but I have enough faith in the community to believe that all this will get sorted.  Once there is something concrete to dispute on then that can be done but right now I am really tired of speculation (even my own) on this. 

I have personally been following Lennart and his group and think there are some good ideas there, some of it is speculative, some of it far-fetched but at the core the direction seems to be helpful.  I have also researched BSD, Gentoo, Slack, etc. and know that if I really see a Gnomie conspiracy I have real alternatives.  For now, I personally want to stay focused on  VSIDO and what we have, hopefully in my small insignificant way to help this stay the best distro it can be.  It's too easy for me to get distracted by things that just don't matter.

More power to them and if they build something that actually works and works well I will be interested. 

Jedi Version!!!!!!!!

Finally an update worthy of my time, the Jedi will undoubtedly be the Edsel of Vsido's, the New Coke of Sid distro's, dare I say it ...........  This will be to Debian what Bob has been to Windows. 

The only thing we need is a little paperclip named Jed to help us with the install.

Seriously, Jedi a well deserved tip of the cap.

Downloading away.

Feel like I am saying this a lot lately. Thanks for the fix.  That was driving me bonkers once it was pointed out to me.

Quote from: VastOne on October 14, 2014, 05:33:10 PM
Being a moderator at #! meant nothing as far as knowing the underlying code or any discussions with the dev, it never happened.  It also was a thankless job... 

I am sure it was meaningless but I promise it wasn't thankless.     I thanked you several times .... errr I think I did.  If I didn't then "THANK YOU!!!"  You did some pretty good stuff over there.

Just starting to read through this thread.  Excellent work as always and greatly appreciate the learning opportunity.  I feel a little better armed than I was and thank you PackRat for following through to the bitter end your effort is a big help.

Quote from: ozitraveller on October 12, 2014, 05:46:06 AM
I read the whole thing, and like the direction systemd is heading, so far. A more flexible and consistent Debian.

I wish Lennert/someone had published some of this before "The Great Systemd Debate".

I think it was published but got lost among all the fud, fud rebuttals and fud for fudsake. I think this because obviously I knew about it but can't remember where I got it?  Lennart somewhere I would think.

I agree that it's something long overdue and I disagree that it will end in "distro-less" Linux.  I think it will lead actually to more flexible Linux and probably a simpler customization process. If systemd is a base that is managing more then there really would be two key building blocks (the kernel and systemd) what lays on top of it will be less important but all will access the info in the same way.  That said, getting info out, repackaging and presenting it, piping it, etc. will be much more consistent and leave more time for creatively using it instead of the current situation where we all use a lot of time creatively getting at what we want to access.  The elephant in the room here of course is "having free access to the info we want in the way we want it".  Maybe not a good example but an example is the current journal/log situation which I am not sure anyone really likes.  Another example is the permissions information that I really can't figure out what the current path/methodology of favor is.  I do like the overall direction though.

Hmm, Lennart's Ramblings the stuff that dreams are made of ..... 

Understand that Lennart see's this a little different.  He is speaking of three varieties one of which is stateless which speaks for itself, another is essentially a developmental state that is barren and yet another which (if IRC) he considers clean which is the OS developer's original state at the touch of a key or as a reboot option.  That is cool and it could be built upon if done correctly.  This all interests me very much.

My issue with being of much help is my lack of any understanding of what really is going on in the install process.  I do use scripts to do some of this (though not really any zenity/yad just a initiating script) but I have scripts around that do the following (not used in this order):

     a. Backs up home and root to a designated drive for re-install
     b. The thumb script that burns an iso and then reboots to install
     c. An app script that grabs the apps installed and then offers them as a checklist.  The user selects them and it feeds to create an apt install script. (this one is a wip but at present I use it, just pretty rough)
     d. A script that restores the proper user files for apps that I know I will be using on my new system, primarily config files, etc.
     e. A script that restores my dropbox stuff.
     f.  A script that restores my beloved cron stuff and confirms the permissions
     g. A script that sets up my equally beloved personal log files
     h. A script that does some hand installs (I run a script that builds my git locally and installs things like my personal dmenu program etc.

I happen to be looking at this stuff and checking it as part of my new install and have a feeling I am missing something.  Also pretty sure there are some I am not thinking of right now so I reserve the right to add to the list.  A lot of this type of thing could be written to be an add on to an install script regardless of where you got the install from.  I typically do it this way, I just haven't been really on the re-install train since VSIDO has spoiled me so horribly and there was no need.  Perhaps none of this interests you and perhaps others have better ways.  I'm just sayin' there it is if it might be a place to start or move closer.

Yep.  Researching now.

I am finding nothing at the moment.  re-installs have no effect nor does trying the siduction version directly.  Not sure what the problem is with uptime but have a theory.  Still looking.

Quote from: PackRat on October 11, 2014, 06:07:40 PM
dmenu is pretty flexible, I have seen scripts (head to the Arch or Gentoo forums) where dmenu is used in menus for multimedia or web content. I don't code, but have always suspected that the underlying code for an openbox pipemenu is doing something similar.

Actually there really isn't any coding in putting together a pipe menu, at least not if you don't want to.  Pipe menu's really are built off a standard template using perl or bash. The originals were made about ten years ago and are pretty extensively documented.  I like them because they can be layered and multi-functional.  You can call another process, run it, comeback to the pipemenu, run some more, etc. which I can't get in a single key click setup and I am pretty sure you can use them in dmenu.  I just really haven't figured it out.

I did review the arch stuff on dmenu and scripts/code and found it confusing.  I may revisit that as I can do some pretty neat stuff with dmenu I just need the proper motivation I guess.  You have inspired me to have another crack at it.  Really love your work here and appreciate your sharing it as well as you thoughts.

Oh, on key combo's.  I have another issue.  I often forget them/which keys/etc and I am a bit like a husband travelling with his wife.  I refuse to stop and ask for directions.    I gave up key bindings for that reason.  For some reason I can remember a script name when I can't remember a key binding, I failed miserable at vi for this reason.

Thanks for the OB stuff.  I really do love openbox. 

Ha, well for today it ends.  Big horse sale and hoping I can find something that can run this January.  After I will look at this lovely work.  Great so far.  I have basically written a script to flip back and forth between OB and flux.  Pretty silly really but then .. isn't that the point   Enjoy your Saturday!