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VSIDO Support => General Support => Topic started by: jedi on November 25, 2016, 06:33:55 AM

Title: (SOLVED) Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: jedi on November 25, 2016, 06:33:55 AM
So like it says in the title!  :D  Ran a 'UP' (another perfect alias) and was totally 'burned' by xorg.  I played around with it for a bit, but needed to be up and running so I restored yesterdays fsa archive!

Just a heads up and a place to ponder this...  ???
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: PackRat on November 25, 2016, 04:58:42 PM
No warning from apt-get, or list of packages getting held back?
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: jedi on November 25, 2016, 10:36:51 PM
No warning from apt-get, or list of packages getting held back?

Nothing held back.  Just a typical dist-up.  A couple of scrots...

To be removed:
(http://en.zimagez.com/miniature/removed.png) (http://en.zimagez.com/zimage/removed.php)

To be upgraded:
(http://en.zimagez.com/miniature/upgraded.png) (http://en.zimagez.com/zimage/upgraded.php)

Upon completion, no X.  Just ends up at a TTY.  I can log in and do whatever then, just no X.  Tried all the tricks I know to get it back, (xorg/X/xserver. whatever...) to no avail.  Just decided in the end to stop trying to figure out something I knew nothing about, and restored the previous days fsarchive.  Now I'm just holding off on the 'UP' till someone says otherwise...

Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: Snap on November 26, 2016, 06:37:06 AM
Same here. No warnings regarding xorg AFAIK. But want to remove the Xserver and nvidia drivers all together.  Apparently the last recent big Xorg upgrade is messy once again.

https://forum.siduction.org/index.php?topic=6455.0

Maybe it's only affecting multiarch systems. Not sure. I don't know when the heck multiarch went in as a depeendency of something... maybe. As far as I remember I wanted to keep it away and never got the intention of installing it, but here it is. Didn't tried to solve the xorg issue this way whatsoever.
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: jedi on November 26, 2016, 05:48:06 PM
Same here. No warnings regarding xorg AFAIK. But want to remove the Xserver and nvidia drivers all together. 
Maybe it's only affecting multiarch systems. Not sure. I don't know when the heck multiarch went in as a depeendency of something... maybe. As far as I remember I wanted to keep it away and never got the intention of installing it, but here it is. Didn't tried to solve the xorg issue this way whatsoever.

And there you have it. When did I ever put in multiarch support for anything?  ??? This is a mystery to me as well...   ???
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: PackRat on November 26, 2016, 08:58:12 PM
Quote
...be fallout of the libc6-update on multiarch machines

might just be the libc6 updates. Either of you running something 32-bit on a 64-bit system - like Skype?
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: jedi on November 26, 2016, 09:05:09 PM
No skype here.  No 32bit of any kind I thought.   ???
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: VastOne on November 26, 2016, 10:54:35 PM
Has this issue passed?

Anyone updated lately that has not been borked?

This is my message on an attempt... it looks safe enough

Code: [Select]
The following packages will be REMOVED:
  xserver-xorg-input-vmmouse xserver-xorg-video-sisusb
The following NEW packages will be installed:
  libldap-common libxfont2
The following packages have been kept back:
  mplayer2
The following packages will be upgraded:
  apt apt-utils aspell-en binutils console-setup console-setup-linux cpp-6 devscripts
  fonts-freefont-ttf g++-6 gcc-6 gcc-6-base gir1.2-gtk-3.0 google-chrome-unstable
  gstreamer1.0-plugins-bad gstreamer1.0-plugins-good gstreamer1.0-pulseaudio
  gtk-update-icon-cache imagemagick imagemagick-6-common imagemagick-6.q16 keyboard-configuration
  libapt-inst2.0 libapt-pkg5.0 libasan3 libatomic1 libavcodec57 libavdevice57 libavfilter6
  libavformat57 libavresample3 libavutil55 libc-bin libc-dev-bin libc-l10n libc6 libc6-dev
  libcc1-0 libcilkrts5 libclass-inspector-perl libfont-afm-perl libgcc-6-dev libgcc1 libgfortran3
  libglib2.0-0 libglib2.0-data libgomp1 libgpgme11 libgstreamer-plugins-bad1.0-0 libgtk-3-0
  libgtk-3-bin libgtk-3-common libimage-magick-perl libimage-magick-q16-perl libitm1
  libldap-2.4-2 liblockfile-bin liblockfile1 liblsan0 libmagick++-6.q16-6v6 libmagickcore-6.q16-2
  libmagickcore-6.q16-2-extra libmagickwand-6.q16-2 libmpx2 libnotmuch4 libpostproc54
  libquadmath0 libsasl2-2 libsasl2-modules libsasl2-modules-db libshine3 libsndio6.1
  libstdc++-6-dev libstdc++6 libswresample2 libswscale4 libtesseract-data libtesseract3 libtsan0
  libubsan0 libudisks2-0 libustr-1.0-1 libvlc-bin libvlc5 libvlccore8 libxfont1 licensecheck
  locales lsb-base lsb-release mplayer mpv multiarch-support python-gpgme rsyslog smplayer
  smplayer-l10n tzdata udisks2 vlc vlc-bin vlc-data vlc-l10n vlc-plugin-base vlc-plugin-notify
  vlc-plugin-qt vlc-plugin-samba vlc-plugin-skins2 vlc-plugin-video-output
  vlc-plugin-video-splitter vlc-plugin-visualization x11-common xfonts-utils xserver-common
  xserver-xorg xserver-xorg-core xserver-xorg-input-all xserver-xorg-input-evdev
  xserver-xorg-input-libinput xserver-xorg-input-mouse xserver-xorg-input-synaptics
  xserver-xorg-input-wacom xserver-xorg-video-all xserver-xorg-video-amdgpu
  xserver-xorg-video-ati xserver-xorg-video-cirrus xserver-xorg-video-fbdev
  xserver-xorg-video-intel xserver-xorg-video-mach64 xserver-xorg-video-mga
  xserver-xorg-video-neomagic xserver-xorg-video-nouveau xserver-xorg-video-qxl
  xserver-xorg-video-r128 xserver-xorg-video-radeon xserver-xorg-video-savage
  xserver-xorg-video-tdfx xserver-xorg-video-trident xserver-xorg-video-vesa
  xserver-xorg-video-vmware
140 upgraded, 2 newly installed, 2 to remove and 1 not upgraded.
Need to get 166 MB of archives.
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: PackRat on November 27, 2016, 12:04:16 AM
I would wait a day or two - part of X is still being removed while the rest is being updated - and I don't see either of those packages in the to be updated group.

Strictly anecdotal evidence, but whenever I see that scenario with X, python, or perl running the upgrade breaks something.
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: jedi on November 27, 2016, 03:54:19 AM
I've not tried to update again.  Just didn't want to fight with it.  I've been updating pretty much daily for many moons now.  In the past though, I've gone a month before so a few days wont hurt.  This is being discussed, as Snap linked above, on other forums so not too worried about it.

I'll forever be indebted to VastOne for showing me fsarchive!  A wonderful tool that has been included in VSIDO since day 1!  Much thanks sir!  What a fast way to get your entire system back.  My root BU to .fsa produces an archive file around 2.2 Gb's.  Restores in about a minute flat!   8)
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: hakerdefo on November 27, 2016, 05:57:47 AM
Code: [Select]
apt-cache rdepends multiarch-support

Will tell you what brings-in multiarch-support.

Cheers!!!
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: Snap on November 27, 2016, 06:30:55 AM
^ Wow, the list of packages is huge! Thanks for the tip, hackerdefo. No idea why this happened. I'm not aware of using any  32 bit software, but I have a real mess here for some reason. Anyway, as jedi already pointed out, a little wait won't hurt.  Let's wait for the xorg transition to settle.

Whenever I change my main system I'll pin multiarch-support to avoid it sliding in again... Or just going back to 32 bit systems.
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: hakerdefo on November 27, 2016, 02:33:34 PM
^ Wow, the list of packages is huge...

There seems a slight misunderstanding  ;)
All of those packages are not installed on your system! Some of them are, but not all of them.
"apt-cache rdepends multiarch-support" will also list those packages that are not installed but pre-requires "multiarch-support".

Much more better way of finding the installed-only list is following,

Code: [Select]
apt-rdepends --state-follow=Installed --state-show=Installed multiarch-support

You will need "apt-rdepends" package installed for the above command.

Yet another way of doing the same is with "aptitude",

Code: [Select]
aptitude why multiarch-support

Output is not as detailed as "apt-rdepends" but should be good-enough for most cases.

Cheers!!!
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: VastOne on November 27, 2016, 11:36:25 PM
I said fuck it and upgraded...  ???  ???  ???

Rebooting now

xserver-xorg-input-vmmouse is for vmware which I do not have and xserver-xorg-video-sisusb is for SiS USB display driver which I have no clue about nor need nor will ever need

Will release a primal scream if I cannot boot to X
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: VastOne on November 27, 2016, 11:41:42 PM
Back with no issues... it took a moment or three longer to appear but it did.. had a strange Mode Not Supported message (from my monitor) and then it started

V-Ger is no pussy...

we got it done...

y'all can update Hold, see below
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: VastOne on November 28, 2016, 01:58:22 AM
Having said and done all that, I would not recommend anyone updating right now if you run Chrome, Kodi or anything Media intensive...

Anything Chrome I launch kills either itself or the entire desktop (freezes)

Kodi is a complete failure... it starts for maybe 15 seconds and then kills the desktop and only a ctrl alt delete works to get you to a new login

These are related but neither is giving ANY indication from terminal or any logs on what is actually happening

Makes filing a bug report just about impossible
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: Snap on November 28, 2016, 06:02:13 AM
WTF!!! Seriously?

Code: [Select]
aptitude why multiarch-support
i   libgstreamer-plugins-base0.10-0 PreDepends multiarch-suppor

gstreamer plugins need multiarch in a 64 bit system? Why?  ::)

I cannot go bravely like VastOne did if I want to keep the Nividia-driver. Maybe I should go back to nouveau... I'll think about it. I'm not happy with this situation to say the truth.

Sometimes dependencies sound absurd. Like mpv pulling in samba. Why a media player necessarily needs the f...ing samba server? It should be an option, not a dependency.
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: hakerdefo on November 28, 2016, 09:04:07 AM
Bookmark following page and keep an eye on "xserver1.19" transition.

https://release.debian.org/transitions/

Cheers!!!
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: PackRat on November 28, 2016, 02:08:36 PM
Quote
I cannot go bravely like VastOne did if I want to keep the Nividia-driver. Maybe I should go back to nouveau... I'll think about it. I'm not happy with this situation to say the truth.

Upgrading X breaks that now? Use to be just kernel upgrades.
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: jedi on November 29, 2016, 12:29:20 AM
I am with Snap.  NVidia card in my laptop.  (GTX 980M)  There is a vast (no relation to VastOne) difference in my display when using Nouveau, instead of the actual NVidia driver.  The NVidia driver makes the graphics card really perform.  Nouveau, not so much.  This is, for me, just an issue with how new the tech is and how it works with old Linux drivers.  My particular graphics card does not like nouveau at all.  Not to get sidetracked, I too am really wondering why mutiarch-support is pulled in.  The following is the output from terminal...

Code: [Select]
jedi@nixnut:~$ apt-rdepends --state-follow=Installed --state-show=Installed multiarch-support
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree       
Reading state information... Done
multiarch-support
  Depends: libc6 (>= 2.3.6-2)
libc6
  Depends: libgcc1
libgcc1
  Depends: gcc-6-base (= 6.2.1-4)
  Depends: libc6 (>= 2.14)
gcc-6-base

And, is 'multiarch-support' indicative that I have the full blown multiarch system files on my system, or is 'multiarch-support' just a small driver file or support file, as it were, that is basically inconsequential?  Just wondering out loud so-to-speak. :)

As hakerdefoe mentions, apt-rdepends will need to be installed.  It is not part of a default VSIDO install.  (yet)
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: Snap on November 29, 2016, 06:53:56 AM
Same here. I've got a GTX 960 a while ago and the there's a real performance difference using one of the two drivers.

It seems once multiarch drops in it's difficult to get rid of it. It's not just the package. once you start going with it, it extends its fingers and makes a mess to remove the thing. Got rid of gstreamer but cannot easily remove multiarch-support. Neither mpv or moc needs gstreamer. Purged the gst thing and I still got the players working nice. I started installing the gts stuff to fully avoid flash player in Iceweasel/Firefox. The stuff is needed so the built-in html5 player could play everything, but I haven't played anything within a browser in about a year. mpv does it all. No more gstreamer for me. For the multiarch part, I think I'll have to swallow it for now.

Quote
Upgrading X breaks that now? Use to be just kernel upgrades.

It seems so. The thing started together with the X transition. Or maybe it's just coincidence, I'm still on the 4.4 LTS kernel patiently waiting for the next LTS kernel, 4.9 due soon.  Maybe the new Xserver doesn't like this kernel.

EDIT: Yes, nvidia-graphics-driver is part of the Xorg transition. So it's not the kernel this time. This package wants to remove the whole Nvidia thing.

https://release.debian.org/transitions/html/xserver1.19.html
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: Snap on November 29, 2016, 07:08:51 AM
Bookmark following page and keep an eye on "xserver1.19" transition.

https://release.debian.org/transitions/

Cheers!!!

Huh, still at 12%. It might be a long one. Thanks, hackedefo. I'll keep an eye on it.
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: Snap on December 01, 2016, 04:51:11 AM
Got it. Today the nvidia driver likes to stay in and only three unneeded xorg video things to remove. Apparently all good after reboot.
Title: Re: (SOLVED) Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: jedi on December 02, 2016, 04:57:15 AM
Way to go Snap!  I too am working splendidly...
Title: Re: Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: VastOne on December 17, 2016, 01:24:43 AM
Having said and done all that, I would not recommend anyone updating right now if you run Chrome, Kodi or anything Media intensive...

Anything Chrome I launch kills either itself or the entire desktop (freezes)

Kodi is a complete failure... it starts for maybe 15 seconds and then kills the desktop and only a ctrl alt delete works to get you to a new login

These are related but neither is giving ANY indication from terminal or any logs on what is actually happening

Makes filing a bug report just about impossible

Am I the only one still struggling with this issue?  The xserver 1.19 transition is at 97 percent but I do not believe it has anything to do with it

Anything after opening more than one tab in Chrome and it freezes... Kodi freezes on any mouse movements to another menu (completely random)

The hardest part about this is neither one of these apps have any error reporting of exactly what is happening.. If I run it from terminal there is nothing there at all that indicates what is going on when it crashes

I am running fine on a partition that has not been updated since all of this started with no crashes whatsoever.. so even though it does not appear to be related to this, it obviously is and it has been going on for 3 weeks straight now

This is a SID issue and expected but it is damn frustrating and even more so because none of the apps affected are VSIDO apps, they are just one I use

BTW it is every version of Chrome and Chromium ... stable to unstable
Title: Re: (SOLVED) Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: jedi on December 17, 2016, 01:56:26 AM
Hey VastOne, I'm having no issues at all now, and haven't since posting around the same time as Snap on this thread.  Sorry to hear your still having issues.  After a couple of conversations with an esteemed seer of mine in the Linux community, I started using Kodi.  If my Kodi was not working properly, I'd have the heads of all the X's out there!  :D
Title: Re: (SOLVED) Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: VastOne on December 17, 2016, 02:01:59 AM
So in a nutshell, you are completely up to day in SID using nVidia drivers and no issues?

I am using nouveau and wonder if that is the issue

Get to IRC please...  ;D
Title: Re: (SOLVED) Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: jedi on December 17, 2016, 02:18:13 AM
Yes, totally up to date as of 3 hours ago, no issues at all in VSIDO using both Fluxbox and KDE Plasma 5.  On 2 different partitions.
Title: Re: (SOLVED) Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: jedi on December 17, 2016, 02:36:10 AM
Aamof, I just checked and noticed that this is the first time I've ever noticed 'Chrome' running with more than one tab open, and I'm still setting at less than 900Mb of RAM being utilized!  Very encouraging as it used to be a real 'HOG'!  I should also clarify, this is a solely personal opinion.  I have so much drive space, on top of (what must seem like a limitless supply to Linux) 32 Gb's of the latest RAM tech, so I really never worry about it.
Also, I've not much experience with Chromium.  Just Chrome...
Title: Re: (SOLVED) Latest xserver updates bork my VSIDO
Post by: VastOne on December 18, 2016, 02:23:45 AM
I installed the latest nVidia drivers and now Chrome and Kodi work flawlessly

At least now I have evidence that the issue is in fact a nouveau driver issue and can now send bug reports to nouveau, Chrome and Kodi developers

Or just wait until the nouveau folks catch up with the X11 changes