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VSIDO Controls => VSIDO Changes => Topic started by: PackRat on January 30, 2016, 02:34:58 AM

Title: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: PackRat on January 30, 2016, 02:34:58 AM
EDIT - I have modified and split this topic to be for the

VSIDO new linstaller Discussion


Links work; site looks good. My connection speed is way slow the last couple days. I will download the 64-bit and install to metal later - hopefully Sunday.

LVM still part of default install? I can set that up as well and let you know how it went.

I would insert "test" or "beta" into the name of the test iso's though.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on January 30, 2016, 02:39:13 AM
^ thanks... On the next versions of the test ISO's the word testing will be in the name

Yes LVM is part of the installers options

Thanks, like resizing the Spock images, this slipped my mind

 ???
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on January 30, 2016, 03:37:50 AM
I forgot to mention ...

If you find the tint2 all wacky when you first boot into a VSIDO testing live-cd,  log out and log back in using a password of live.  This brings you back in clean and tint2 is where it should be

By restarting FluxBox from the right click menu options you can reset tint2 and is a better option

This is due to some recent changes to X11 and should be corrected soon...
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: Snap on January 30, 2016, 07:18:10 AM
Thanks, vastOne. I'll do some tests this weekend.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: PackRat on January 30, 2016, 02:37:11 PM
the download went without a hitch, and the md5 checksum on the 64-bit iso is good.

Edit - live session of 64-bit working, no tint2 issue on this system. All the hardware working OOTB, and network interfaces default to eth0 and wlan0:

(http://en.zimagez.com/miniature/screenshot2016-01-3014-49-56.png) (http://en.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot2016-01-3014-49-56.php)
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: filip on January 30, 2016, 04:09:16 PM
Writing from live, while installing in the background ( with latest installer & custom_kernel_args )...

Now, a few nitpicks/suggestions/observations:

- It would be nice to have VBox Guest Additions preinstalled on ISO, since for me atleast, working in 640x480 and without shared clipboard/folders tends to be annoying.

- X issues you mentioned exist in (latest, 5.14) VBox, and I couldn't get rid of them even with a full restart of LightDM.
Everything is fine on metal.

- +1 on using SpaceFM. Awesome file manager with even more awesome features.
While at it, purely estetic and subjective, but I find it's coloration of a Root window quite ugly and somewhat distracting.
Though it can be disabled by unchecking "Show root user indicator color" in Preferences/Interface.

- Since, by using a Flux, you're aiming for light weight, I suggest you to take a look at SMTube.
It's a small YouTube browser which opens videos in a selected player ( SMPlayer by default ).
The gain here is in the fact that any player is many times faster and much less CPU intensive compared to watching online.
For example, I can watch 720p silky smooth with VLC on an ancient Athlon XP ( single core @2GHz, slow as hell ), while online it's basically a slide show.

- And to really nitpick, Apt seems to miss package lists in live, so in order to install something you need to get them first ( apt-get update ).

Besides that, great job! Blazing fast, good selection of apps, and +1 from me on using a dark theme. :)
Once I have enough time, I'll switch to VSIDO for a couple of days in order to take a proper look.

Rebooting now.... :)
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: filip on January 30, 2016, 04:49:58 PM
All good.

Except that I forgot about: http://vsido.org/index.php?topic=1124.msg12625#msg12625
So I didn't get a network, but it's my mistake...

What's important is that installer now correctly appends to GRUB_CMD:

(http://en.zimagez.com/miniature/196ee07ff887140d7517ac45df30313c6.png) (http://en.zimagez.com/zimage/196ee07ff887140d7517ac45df30313c6.php)

:)
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on January 31, 2016, 12:30:26 AM
@PackRat, thanks for the testing and feedback, stellar as always and I appreciate it... I am assuming yours is on metal and the reason why you did not see the tint2 issues.. do you use V-Box at all?

@Filip

Thank you for the feedback.  Regarding VBox Guest Additions, they fall just outside of the 'need vs want' space saving situation... They take up a huge space on an ISO for a small amount of people to benefit from.. I like them too and set them up if I need them... it is that easy, but it is not feasible to have them on the ISO

Interesting that a logout did not resolve the tint2/X issue.. on every test I ran with it that worked.  The install worked and that is what matters.. By restarting FluxBox from the right click menu options you can reset tint2 as well

I am a huge fan of IgnorantGuru, the dev of SpaceFM and several other incredible viable tools.. We have used SpaceFM from day one here and really I could not see ever using any other file manager

We already use SMTube as part of SMPlayer ...

Apt is that way by design knocking off 40 MiB of space on the ISO using bleachbit before building does this... Sorry!

Great feedback!
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: PackRat on January 31, 2016, 01:14:12 AM
@vastone - I have not installed to metal yet. Been airing out camping equipment today.

I do not use V-box.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: jedi on January 31, 2016, 02:22:03 AM
Worked great on metal!  Installed just now in V-Box.  On startup it has the screwed up Tint2 stuff.  A simple restart of Fluxbox fixes this on my V-Box install.  I did not see this or any other issues on metal...
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on January 31, 2016, 02:31:33 AM
Thanks Jedi    8)
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: PackRat on January 31, 2016, 03:04:44 PM
My first attempt failed - install went to completion, but booted to a blinking cursor after the initial splash screen. I think it may be because I attempted to create LVM during the install. I'll make a second attempt without the LVM.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on January 31, 2016, 03:18:15 PM
^ I saw issues with anything other than ext.. xfs and reiser both fails

You might want to run this as you run for the reports:

Code: [Select]
# Terminal 1:
sudo linstaller -f=glade start

# Terminal 2:
tail -f /var/log/linstaller/linstaller_latest.log

Later today I will redo the xfs and reiser to generate those reports
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on January 31, 2016, 03:23:04 PM
You also indicated you are not seeing the tint2 issue...

What type of video card do you use?

Edit -- And what version of VirtualBox?
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: PackRat on January 31, 2016, 03:29:01 PM
I ran the live version on an intel video card.

The install is with nvidia.

The LVM was created - was there when repartitioning for 2nd attempt - and grub was installed to the MBR. The computer started to boot, but then hung right away with a blinking cursor. Don't know if it was a grub or fstab issue.

The second install just completed.... rebooting.

Edit - Second install went without a hitch; rebooted into VSIDO and no tint2 issues. Network interfaces are wlan0, eth0, and all hardware recognized out of the box.

I suspect there may be a a bug in the LVM setup - although I will not rule out that the issue exists between the chair and the keyboard. When trying to create a LVM (3 HDD on this unit) I could assign the partitions/drives to LVM during manual partitioning, but I could not create a name for the LVM - I could enter it on the screen, but not have the installer accept it. Without that name, I think the boot process didn't read the fstab properly and hung.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on January 31, 2016, 05:06:23 PM
^ Good intel...

Version of V-Box?

You use something other than VirtualBox... ;)
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on January 31, 2016, 05:34:49 PM
Did a lot of testing today... posted several issues on git when using something other than ext4 as the root partition...

Did get a good ext4 install though..

First sub 2:30 install

(http://www.zimagez.com/miniature/screenshot2016-01-3117-19-20.png) (http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot2016-01-3117-19-20.php)
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: PackRat on January 31, 2016, 09:03:54 PM
Both my attempts were done with ext4 format and a swap partition - I obviously missed that this format was an issue. D'oh!  ::) totally mis-read the issue you were having.

I do not use V-box or any other virtualiztion. If I have a spare partition, I may dual boot; otherwise, I just do a clean install and roll with it. For this test install, I brought the dual-core AMD out of retirement and did a clean install. It has the 3 HDD so I wanted to try LVM as well in case I want to use it as a file server of some sort. The successful install finished in about 3-4 minutes while I checked email on the other computer. Rather impressive.

I like the new installer. The only feature I miss on either of the vsido installers is the option to specify a user-defined mount point - i,e, /media/music - maybe I missed it on the new installer, but it looked like the options were limited to /, /home, /usr, /var, and swap - all the basics
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: misko_2083 on February 01, 2016, 12:18:09 AM
As Dragan said:
https://gitlab.com/trios-linux/trios-installer/issues/1 (https://gitlab.com/trios-linux/trios-installer/issues/1)
Some packages will have to be installed for xfs, hfs+ and raiserfs file systems. Tools to format and mount partitions.
For hfs hfsutils. hfsprogs is allready installed
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: PackRat on February 01, 2016, 03:38:09 AM
Did a second install to metal. One major issue -

at the create user dialog, I opted to activate the root account/password. The installer accepted the root password and went to completion. After reboot, I Ctrl-Alt-F1 to tty1 and tried to log in as root to do the upgrades. Not only was the root password not recognized/authenticated, sudo was disabled so I had no root privileges  :'(

Tried the root password with the caps lock on just in case - no go. Pretty sure I did not make a typo - certainly not the same one twice.

Ended up booting with the live CD and adding my user name to sudo in /etc/group. Had root privileges on reboot and created a root passwd. Can log in as root now.

Any one else have this issue, or am I the only lunatic that enables the root account?
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on February 01, 2016, 03:40:49 AM
I saw this on the very first install ... since then I have left root alone on the user account creation and handled root pw after install

Thanks for reminding me..  We need to file a bug report on that

I'll run an install with log catching on and send it up to them as a bug

:)
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: PackRat on February 01, 2016, 03:54:27 AM
I also noticed that the /etc/default/grub file that gets installed with the test installer has the GRUB_TIMEOUT set to 0, and the GRUB_HIDDEN_TIMEOUT set to 2. Since VSIDO has memtest installed by default, you may want to reset those times so that the menu appears.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on February 01, 2016, 04:00:13 AM
^ That is new... I have only seen it as of today and only in using the Automatic partitioning option.. Did you use that one or Manual partitioning?
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: Snap on February 01, 2016, 09:45:08 AM
No time for tests this weekend but finally onto it. Installed in VirtualBox. Got the same root account issues that PackRat already reported. I'm one of those geeks that like to use the root account and no xserver for the distro-upgrades (specially the big boys like xserver gcc, etc... when they come. though some times for small things I'm lazy to logout, du and go back to my regular user). Anyways. password is not recognized. Cannot use the root account. Otherwise it seems fine. Going to play a bit and check if anything else pops up.

Amazing installazion time, BTW. Oh, and no issues with my keyboard layout (won't miss the refracta installer, LOL). Will follow a spanish locale install in a while, just to check.

PS, used manual partitioning. Grub timeout is set at 2 sec in my case.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: Snap on February 01, 2016, 10:11:42 AM
Installation with spanish locale completed. Not good. Everything is in English. Not a problem for me since I always use US English in all my systems, but an issue for possible non US citizens/users I guess.

The root account issue persists. Not able to login as root from lightdm or su in a terminal. Password not recognized.

PS. The created users are not included in sudoers in both installations. No way to do anything as sudo or root. I suppose it's all related with enabling the root account as PackRat reported.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: PackRat on February 01, 2016, 12:21:40 PM
^ That is new... I have only seen it as of today and only in using the Automatic partitioning option.. Did you use that one or Manual partitioning?

I always use manual partitioning.

The hidden grub timeout is set for 2 seconds - which is probably enough time to use the key binding to get to the menu if you want to boot a different kernel or rescue mode - what is that key combo, ESC? However, since VSIDO is somewhat unique in installing memtest by default, you may want to go back to the usual visible grub menu option.

@Snap - yes, not having any users in the sudoers file is the norm if you enable the root password during install - the fine print after you switch the button to "on" points out that sudo for users is disabled when root password is enabled.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on February 01, 2016, 03:22:40 PM
Did a second install to metal. One major issue -

at the create user dialog, I opted to activate the root account/password. The installer accepted the root password and went to completion. After reboot, I Ctrl-Alt-F1 to tty1 and tried to log in as root to do the upgrades. Not only was the root password not recognized/authenticated, sudo was disabled so I had no root privileges  :'(

Tried the root password with the caps lock on just in case - no go. Pretty sure I did not make a typo - certainly not the same one twice.

Ended up booting with the live CD and adding my user name to sudo in /etc/group. Had root privileges on reboot and created a root passwd. Can log in as root now.

Any one else have this issue, or am I the only lunatic that enables the root account?

I passed this up as a bug to the trios team (https://gitlab.com/trios-linux/trios-installer/issues/5)

FYI, the password for root is 'vsido' the same as it is on the live-cd...

So it never gets changed, the step seems to be passed over during the install as opposed to failing

Will let you know the progress
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: misko_2083 on February 01, 2016, 03:34:23 PM
@VastOne thank you for reporting
We'll see what's going on.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: PackRat on February 01, 2016, 05:38:56 PM
Quote
We already use SMTube as part of SMPlayer ...

You sure about that?

Clean install:

(http://en.zimagez.com/miniature/sshot-february14543482211366x768.png) (http://en.zimagez.com/zimage/sshot-february14543482211366x768.php)

something broken in the configuration/path?

Edit - I had to [re] - install it.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on February 01, 2016, 06:31:23 PM
I have been known to fail, I have again and will correct this

Thanks
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on February 01, 2016, 08:26:03 PM
Adding smtube adds 56 MiB of space to the disk translating into another 20 MiB growth on the ISO's

It was removed because of this and will not be going back on...

After all the testing and adoption of the new installer is complete, I am going to open a discussion on what should be a part of the after install vsido-welcome script... that is dated and this would be a perfect choice to add to it

Anyone who wants to champion that effort, you have my one hundred percent support and following.. 

In other words, I could really use the help...
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: Snap on February 02, 2016, 07:02:36 AM
@PackRat: You are right. I'm too used to su-to-root, so I hardly ever use sudo for anything.

Quote
After all the testing and adoption of the new installer is complete, I am going to open a discussion on what should be a part of the after install vsido-welcome script... that is dated and this would be a perfect choice to add to it

About the welcome script, I think the it didn't popped up after these two last installs. I might be wrong. I have a pretty crap memory.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: filip on February 02, 2016, 02:43:51 PM
@Filip

Thank you for the feedback.  Regarding VBox Guest Additions, they fall just outside of the 'need vs want' space saving situation... They take up a huge space on an ISO for a small amount of people to benefit from.. I like them too and set them up if I need them... it is that easy, but it is not feasible to have them on the ISO

Interesting that a logout did not resolve the tint2/X issue.. on every test I ran with it that worked.  The install worked and that is what matters.. By restarting FluxBox from the right click menu options you can reset tint2 as well

I am a huge fan of IgnorantGuru, the dev of SpaceFM and several other incredible viable tools.. We have used SpaceFM from day one here and really I could not see ever using any other file manager

We already use SMTube as part of SMPlayer ...

Apt is that way by design knocking off 40 MiB of space on the ISO using bleachbit before building does this... Sorry!

Great feedback!

@vbox:

Yeah, I tought it's probably a space issue.

@IG:
Indeed. Guy has really awesome ideas, and even more awesome way of implementing them in practice ( I'm talking about spacefm primarily ).
Making the thing lightweight, fast and simple like it is, and at the same time having the level of customization and advanced features it has, is beyond words really.

I, for example, do most of the dev work inside it. Since using plugins I can do a lot of stuff, ranging from building packages, interacting with git, having an app menu, comparing files etc, all without the need to frequently switch to other applications or terminal(s).

@apt:

I tought it perhaps got left out unintentionally.
Certanly not a problem, and there's certanly no need to be sorry! :)

^ That is new... I have only seen it as of today and only in using the Automatic partitioning option.. Did you use that one or Manual partitioning?

I always use manual partitioning.

The hidden grub timeout is set for 2 seconds - which is probably enough time to use the key binding to get to the menu if you want to boot a different kernel or rescue mode - what is that key combo, ESC? However, since VSIDO is somewhat unique in installing memtest by default, you may want to go back to the usual visible grub menu option.

@Snap - yes, not having any users in the sudoers file is the norm if you enable the root password during install - the fine print after you switch the button to "on" points out that sudo for users is disabled when root password is enabled.

GRUB is hidden by default, if there are no other OS's found.
However, this behaviour can be disabled with a seed.
Code: [Select]
[module:bootloader]
should_hide_menu = False

:)

Btw, (holding) "Shift" is the key to display GRUB.

@root pass:

I'm looking into what can be done about it, but it seems that both Debconf and user-setup were designed around Debian default of not having a root pass at all ( empty one ), or there is a bug in either one.
I might be wrong though, so when I have a more definitive answer, I'll let you know. :)
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on February 02, 2016, 03:12:06 PM

@PackRat: You are right. I'm too used to su-to-root, so I hardly ever use sudo for anything.

About the welcome script, I think the it didn't popped up after these two last installs. I might be wrong. I have a pretty crap memory.

@snap

If you elect to change the root pw from the installer, it will fail as it is designed to work with sudo enabled.  I would hear more about su-to-root as a possible replacement specific to vsido-welcome needs (and anything/everything else related to sudo)



GRUB is hidden by default, if there are no other OS's found.
However, this behaviour can be disabled with a seed.
Code: [Select]
[module:bootloader]
should_hide_menu = False

:)

Btw, (holding) "Shift" is the key to display GRUB.

@root pass:

I'm looking into what can be done about it, but it seems that both Debconf and user-setup were designed around Debian default of not having a root pass at all ( empty one ), or there is a bug in either one.
I might be wrong though, so when I have a more definitive answer, I'll let you know. :)

I will add the seed for grub to show up, that is the expected or 'normal' behaviour we here have been used to

On the root pw issue, is it a problem enough to change it?  The message during install is clear enough in stating the sudo functions will be removed and it is recommended NOT doing that.  IMO, anyone with knowledge enough to make this choice 'should' know the consequences behind this choice.  It is especially important to make the decision to enable root on a 'when needed' moment IMO.

Perhaps adding a more information on how easy it is to enable root password after install (ie sudo passwd root)

I am not sure what the solution is but like the discussion about it and encourage more

@filip, I did find a slick fix for fluxbox on the tint2 issue on the live-cd.  I hope you got to see this as well (http://vsido.org/index.php?topic=1132.msg12737#msg12737)
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: filip on February 02, 2016, 04:34:44 PM

@PackRat: You are right. I'm too used to su-to-root, so I hardly ever use sudo for anything.

About the welcome script, I think the it didn't popped up after these two last installs. I might be wrong. I have a pretty crap memory.

@snap

If you elect to change the root pw from the installer, it will fail as it is designed to work with sudo enabled.  I would hear more about su-to-root as a possible replacement specific to vsido-welcome needs (and anything/everything else related to sudo)



GRUB is hidden by default, if there are no other OS's found.
However, this behaviour can be disabled with a seed.
Code: [Select]
[module:bootloader]
should_hide_menu = False

:)

Btw, (holding) "Shift" is the key to display GRUB.

@root pass:

I'm looking into what can be done about it, but it seems that both Debconf and user-setup were designed around Debian default of not having a root pass at all ( empty one ), or there is a bug in either one.
I might be wrong though, so when I have a more definitive answer, I'll let you know. :)

I will add the seed for grub to show up, that is the expected or 'normal' behaviour we here have been used to

On the root pw issue, is it a problem enough to change it?  The message during install is clear enough in stating the sudo functions will be removed and it is recommended NOT doing that.  IMO, anyone with knowledge enough to make this choice 'should' know the consequences behind this choice.  It is especially important to make the decision to enable root on a 'when needed' moment IMO.

Perhaps adding a more information on how easy it is to enable root password after install (ie sudo passwd root)

I am not sure what the solution is but like the discussion about it and encourage more

@filip, I did find a slick fix for fluxbox on the tint2 issue on the live-cd.  I hope you got to see this as well (http://vsido.org/index.php?topic=1132.msg12737#msg12737)

Good idea on adding info about enabling root after install. I'll add to the installer as well. :)

@su-to-root:

I guess you guys probably know about it, but I'll mention it just in case.
Code: [Select]
sudo -i... can be used for the same "effect". Meaning that you get a root (login)/prompt, same as with "su".

@Flux:

I've seen it, but didn't have time to download.
Will do later today & report back. :)
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: Snap on February 03, 2016, 07:59:44 AM
Quote
If you elect to change the root pw from the installer, it will fail as it is designed to work with sudo enabled.  I would hear more about su-to-root as a possible replacement specific to vsido-welcome needs (and anything/everything else related to sudo)

Yeah, my fault. Rushing and not reading everything. I always use different passwords for root and users. I asummed on the fly it was just that, setting a root pasword instead of disabling sudo.

I don't like the current (rather global) tendency of comodity at the cost of security/privacy. In the case of sudo and Linux, enabling sudo for everything even without a password. I prefer to allow sudo to just logout and shutdown passwordless. The rest is in charge of su-to-root set as su. I totally favor su-to-root into the welcome script.

PS, if the root password remains unchanged and left as live default ie; vsido. IMHO, a warning in the installer should be needed. Just in case.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: Snap on February 03, 2016, 08:05:17 AM
BTW, new iso installed good.
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on February 03, 2016, 05:00:08 PM
Thank you snap, that is very good information that I agree with
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: VastOne on February 04, 2016, 03:24:00 AM
@Filip You might like this (http://vsido.org/index.php?topic=1136.msg12762#msg12762)
Title: Re: VSIDO new linstaller Discussion
Post by: DeepDayze on May 29, 2017, 12:29:45 AM
Quote
If you elect to change the root pw from the installer, it will fail as it is designed to work with sudo enabled.  I would hear more about su-to-root as a possible replacement specific to vsido-welcome needs (and anything/everything else related to sudo)

Yeah, my fault. Rushing and not reading everything. I always use different passwords for root and users. I asummed on the fly it was just that, setting a root pasword instead of disabling sudo.

I don't like the current (rather global) tendency of comodity at the cost of security/privacy. In the case of sudo and Linux, enabling sudo for everything even without a password. I prefer to allow sudo to just logout and shutdown passwordless. The rest is in charge of su-to-root set as su. I totally favor su-to-root into the welcome script.

PS, if the root password remains unchanged and left as live default ie; vsido. IMHO, a warning in the installer should be needed. Just in case.

To me, I use sudo only for my main user account. Other accounts I create on my system won't necessarily be set up with sudo access. I do set sudo to prompt for password while letting shutdown/reboot be the only operations that can be done w/o any password via sudo.